Sticking Clutch

Yeah, considered the lever pull adjustment. I set it to maximum reach to gain the most cable pull but still no joy with the drag. Really hope it is due to contamination as you suggest. I believe the design change you're referring to is regards the release pin which on some later 1050 engines has an oilway machined into the running surface. Mine is just a plain round shaft which is a loose sliding fit into the hollow gearbox shaft which is internally oil-fed. I'm very curious to know how much oil is fed to the clutch through this shaft ... and indeed how much oil is required (and if there can be too much oil!).

The baskets both show marks from where the tabs of the clutch rings have sat but there's virtually no burring. Running my finger along the surface I can feel the indentations but I'm not convinced it's enough to grab the plates. I am tempted however, to put the new rings back in a different order, mixing up the spacings, so as not to sit in the old grooves.

While I've got the covers off, and as chuk raised the question I took the opportunity to compare the dipstick level to the clutch. It seems, (counter-intuitively) the bottom of the clutch is about 30mm above sump oil level, so the only oil it sees is that fed from the gearbox shaft.

 

[QUOTE="picked up rear puncture DOH![/QUOTE]
Bad luck mate

On the subject of centre stands, I'd had my bike a week and eventually had to go to Youtube to find the technique to get my ST on the stand! Up until then I'd failed every time and nearly dropped the bugger twice! And I'm really not a weakling! #newbiewithfirstbigbike

 

Update if any one is interested:

Picked up the new Triumph clutch plates today and fitted them this evening.

Couple of interesting points. Bearing in mind this is the genuine clutch from the Triumph dealer, ordered against my VIN, it is slightly different to the one I've taken out. The old steel rings were just plain, flat, pressed steel whereas the new ones have a matrix of tiny dimples pressed into both sides. The friction plates bear the same identity codes to the old ones and yet the little friction pads are about 2/3 the area of the old ones - same number of pads to each ring but the pads are maybe 1/3 shorter radially. Both these features look to me like they'd lessen the chance of plates sticking together ... was this a design change with that in mind?

I drenched it all in new oil before reassembly and it all went back together a treat.

Several people have suggested (and sounded quite knowledgeable) to use semi-synthetic oil so I've drained out the fully synthetic and replaced with semi.

I also saw on another forum someone mention the orientation of the steel plates which I'd not considered. Being pressed they are 'sided' in that one side has a rounded cut edge, the other a sharper edge. Putting the plates in with the sharp edge facing inwards they will (hopefully) relax easier when the pressure plate is released and not drag on the baskets ... that's the theory anyway!

Finally, no one has convinced me the steel rings need to go back in a particular order so I've mixed the 1.6 and 2mm order up to give the inner rings a different seating position on the baskets so they don't sit back into the old tab impressions.

It's pretty icy out so I haven't ridden it but it started and ran fine and gear selection seems very good with neutral easy to select which it's never been before. I'll report back when I get a chance to ride it.

Tried to upload some photos of the rings but don't seem able to any more ... site just hangs every time. Probably me being computer illiterate!

 

Bottom ring old steel, then new steel with dimples, old friction ring and on top the new friction ring with much smaller pads.

 

Cheers Col. Yes, the stack height checked out ok. I've put the 2mm steel plates to the inner end of the stack so shifting the contact points of the inner plates 0.8mm out. Whether that makes any difference at all I've no idea but I can't see it hurting.

 

Cheers Ken, others have said the same when using fully synthetic and then problems improved going to semi. Maybe anecdotal but the more it's reported the more it seems possibly causal.

Sprinter, it looks very much like the old steel rings have been very hot to cause the darkening.

Just got back from a wet, windy, three hour test ride in the dark (headlight is CRAP!) and at the moment I'm a very happy bunny! I can get neutral with ease (YAY) and the clutch and gearbox is transformed! No drag at standstill and easy gear changes. I still don't entirely trust it yet though; I select neutral as soon as stationary.

Time will tell if it's cured I guess. Others who've been down this road have reported symptoms returning after a while. My hope is that it's either me putting the wrong oil in or the previous owner putting the very wrong (car) oil in. As it's done over 40K miles and appears to have the original clutch the design must have worked but seeing the replacement is so different makes me wonder if it was always close to the limit.

Thanks again for your advice everyone, hopefully when the weather improves a bit I'll get a few more miles bagged and I'll report back whether it's still a fix.

Just like to add I BLOODY LOVE RIDING IT! I'm a complete novice I know, and what the hell do I know, but what a machine! As Americans so often say; HELL YEAH!

 

Good info thanks capt Would be nice to know why they're cooked, but guess I'll never know. Suffice to say I've now put another 500 miles on it since the clutch pack change and oil change (semi-synth this time) and the clutch is still perfect and gear change solid. Just starting to 'trust' it now and confident to sit in traffic a few moments in first with clutch in rather than waiting for the last moment to select gear and drive off. Looks like a fix and I'm sooooo loving the bike!

 

Hi Tom, really sorry for the delayed response; been laid a bit low with a little bug that's doing the rounds!!!

Mine's a 2010. Check the pics above re the difference in the clutch plates from original to what Triumph supplied to replace them. I suspect they're the same fitment across most of the 1050 engines (though I'm no expert!). The replacements have a much smaller friction material contact area and the plain steel plates now have an array of tiny dimples across them. My old plates, although within dimension tolerance, had been cooked, resulting in the darker colour. This had likely contaminated the surfaces causing the problems of further overheating and drag.

I'm now around 8,000 miles in and the clutch/gearbox is still performing just fine. My fix just came down to new genuine clutch pack and semi-synthetic oil. No oilway modifications as suggested on other posts/forums.

Hope you solve your issue.

Cheers

 

Cowl on mine was changed (before I bought the bike); it now has an after-market cowl with adjustable wind deflector strip.