Speed Triple Rs 4th Gear Problems

Triumph insiders have read your very interesting post...and now they are hiding the test bike from you

 

Hi Guys . . . sorry for the delay in posting but the British weather hasn't been kind and being something of a girlie, I haven't been keen to test the RS in the inclement weather but today, the sun shone - well, almost . . . . . .
I might have to reconsider my earlier statements about the 1050 gearbox - the current incarnation of the engine is a different animal to the earlier version installed in my 2008 Tiger and riding the Speed Triple proved a revelation in a number of ways. I feel a little uncertain about posting on this thread because only a percentage of my observations relate to the quickshifter issue to which this discussion is addressed and so I will be creating a new Thread entitled "Speed Triple RS Test Ride". The only question now facing me is whether or not I can justify having 3 motorbikes - To buy or not to buy, that is the question . . . . .

 

Hi again . . . I'm all but ready to take the plunge. The dealer has offered me the bike at full retail with TPMS fitted and the quickshifter kit boxed and given to me for later fitment or to sell as I wish. Incidentally, although the demo hadn't been fitted with the modified gear linkage, I asked a friend to switch through the gears both up and down whilst I scrutinised the shift assist unit - there was no clashing or interference, indeed, the nearest the body of the unit came to the shift arm was about 1mm . . . . .
Anyway - back on topic . . . . I thought I would download the fitting instructions and perhaps keep them with the quickshifter until I have decided what to do with it but meanwhile, couldn't resist the temptation to read through the instructions, mainly because I wanted to find out if the kit is plug and play or if future installation might prove a little more involved.
It seems that having installed the unit, not only does the shift assist require activating in the console but the ECU requires updating with an appropriate map which includes the shift assist unit. I realise this is a long shot but . . . . . .
SteveRS said his second bike also displayed the same behaviour as the first and although his has not proved to be an isolated incident, lightning doesn't usually strike twice! SteveRS knows how to ride a bike and how to change gear and yet two separate bikes have displayed the same issue. The two common factors would be a. the same dealer and b. unless I misunderstood an earlier post, the same quickshifter fitted to both bikes. . . .
Could it be that his dealer activated shift assist in the bikes consoles but failed to update the ECU with the correct engine map and so the ECU doesn't react properly to his gearchange inputs??? It's only a thought but maybe there are bikes out there where mechanical interference with the shifter has been an issue and for others, maybe dealers haven't been correctly loading the updated maps incorporating shift assist?? It is at least a possibility. It seems the bikes are supplied from the factory in standard tune and as such, various permutations are possible - maybe on the first bike, the issue was mechanical and on receipt of the second, the quickshifter was fitted, activated in the console but updating the ECU map overlooked? SteveRS - thoughts??

https://www.triumphinstructions.com/ProdDocs/A9930428-EN.pdf

 

Hi Alan, that’s interesting regarding the ECU needing an updated map. That’s the first time I’ve heard of that. The dealer never mentioned that during the whole fiasco. That’s something I will bring up with them when I’m there next, which will be next week when I’m fitting some new tires. As far as the quickshifter, no it’s not the same shifter. The new bike had its own shifter, as they come standard here in North America. So, as they come standard here, you would think the ECU would have been updated either at the factory or by the dealer. Yes I like to believe that I know how to shift a motorcycle, since I’ve been riding from the age of 12, and I’m now 52. Yikes, that hurt typing that lol. You never know, it could be something as simple as that. Once I talk to the dealer I’ll let you know.

 

Well. . . . just a punt but if you're talking two bikes and two different shifters, that only leaves an even bigger question mark hanging over the remaining variable . . . the dealership!!?? I just took another look at the instructions and I appear to have misquoted in that it isn't another "map" but the "correct engine calibration" which the dealer has to download. The argument remains the same and just activating in the console isn't sufficient.
Here in the UK and with shift assist a dealer fit option, it would seem this responsibility must rest firmly with the dealer. If the equipment is standard in Canada, it could still be fitted by the dealership and in which case the same work would need carrying out. Also, if fitted and calibrated at the factory, it's not inconceivable that bikes leave UK shores without the work having been done.
One possible pointer in respect of your dealers fitting and calibrating as part of the PDI (pre-delivery inspection here in the UK) is the need to run the bike for 10 seconds in each gear - I'm not sure the factory would want to arse around doing this and might just leave it to the seller at point of collection?
Still, it's a thought at least - keep us posted

 

The bikes in North America come with the quickshifter fitted by the factory, but hey you never know. I will be inquiring about this.

 

Hi Guys, sorry to sound like a scratched record here but I’ve been reading through the warranty claims thread (still deciding!!) and came across a post by Steve RS which made me think of another possible cause.
I’m convinced there’s an explanation lurking somewhere and I can’t accept Steve’s issues were coincidence.
On the warranty thread, I noted in the email SteveRS wrote to Bloor where he mentioned another problem In that his original bike revved very high when under load but failed to describe the issue in detail. Obviously the thing will rev like crazy if it hits a false neutral on an open throttle during an up shift but as he said this was a separate problem, I took it to mean that perhaps driving along in top gear and opening the throttle would result in clutch slip ie - the same problem that one or two others have mentioned caused by an overly tight clutch lever. . . . . . ?
That set me thinking - in the S1K and the S3, the quickshifter doesn’t work if the clutch is pulled. Now, I’m not sure about the S3 but certainly on the S1K, there is a microswitch in the clutch lever housing which deactivated the quickshifter the moment the clutch is pulled. Loads of S1K owners got caught out cos they fitted aftermarket leavers not designed to work with the microswitch and bingo . . . . . Shift assist would no longer work. The S3 appears to have an electric cable to the lever and I suspect will house a similar switch - this gives us two more modes of action for shift assist failures
1. Rider pulls away in first gear, having released the clutch but this fails to fully return and leaves the microswitch potentially with a poor contact or maybe even making and breaking contact - this would completely screw with shift assist . . . .no doubt about it.
2. Some riders, me included, like to ride with their hands wrapped around the clutch lever - in my case it comes from riding 2-strokes and the knowledge that I am always a nanosecond away from instant seizure and hence ready to pull the clutch. Now take a scenario where your free play is a little loose resulting in a slightly flappy clutch lever but the rider’s digits may also be wrapped around it - this too could activate/deactivate the shift assist randomly and screw with its operation
I suspect best way to avoid would be
A. Not ride with your fingers around the clutch
B. Adjust the clutch cable for the absolute minimum of free play and thus avoid triggering the switch unless deliberately pulling in the clutch.
C. Ensure lever bolt is tightened correctly and mechanism lubricated sufficiently to allow full and complete operation of the clutch.

As I said, these issues have to have an explanation and it sure as hell isn’t solved by cutting a little notch in the gearshift lever.
What do you think SteveRS - do you ride with your fingers around the clutch? How do you have yours adjusted? And did you have the sticky clutch problem and is that what you were referring to in your email to Bloor???

 

Alan, the reving up was in 4th gear only, because of the damage the gearbox had incurred due to the false neutrals during hard acceleration quick shifts. Others had experienced the same issue after gearbox damage. I also experienced a slightly sticky clutch lever on the second bike. I resolved the issue immediately and it hasn’t been an issue since. The first bike never suffered from the sticky clutch lever issue, and the second bike had quickshifter issues before the sticky clutch. I ride with two fingers resting on top of the clutch, never pulling in at all. So in my experiences on both bikes it doesn’t appear that the clutch was a contributing factor for quickshifter false neutrals.

 

no QS here (Thank God) but the rest is similar. Sticky lever: yes, but solved in 2 min.

 

Steve RS . . . it still could be the clutch; I wouldn't necessarily be too quick to dismiss it as the cause. I haven't examined the switch in detail - it could be it only trips when the clutch is pulled in a fair way but if the lever itself is adjusted with a large amount of free play, it could potentially move enough to trip the microswitch without the rider even touching it. . . . just through vibrations and wind pressure perhaps. It has been a reliability issue on the S1k but not normally resulting in false neutrals, more a question of the bike simply refusing to change gear. There is an explanation somewhere and I don't believe it has anything to do with fouling of the gearshift arm.

 

I have a similar problem. I bought a Speed Triple RS last year. Quickshihter always caused problems. It is better after service and replacement of the faulty item. Earlier I had a problem with the change of some gears, sometimes they just jumped - now is the massacre. Once in a while when shifting down at low and medium RPM 3,000 RPM to 5,000 feel the strong impact of the gears in the crate against each other and the strong drive of the gears and jerk the chain. in addition, sometimes the motorcycle kicks and pulls forward when reducing. gear shifts down always at 3500 to 5500 RPM, the gas is fully closed and without touching the clutch handle. I regret that I decided on quickshifter. Do You think like this. the way I use a motorcycle will have a heavy impact on the gearbox? or is it rather discomfort and a stupid feeling ...

 

Personally, i'd switch it off asap.
I think thats done via the dash settings.
I think that the damage MAY of already been done prior to the arm replacement though.
Get triumph to take it out and get the fault logged in the system though (for time and warranty purposes)

 

Yhm thanks so so there is no chance that this would work normally? before replacing the arm I did maybe 1 thousand km with a damaged quckshifter my question and the thing that worries me the most is whether what is going on now destroys the gearbox and the drive. sometimes the impact on the gears and parts of chain drive is really strong. as if the quickshifter did not work completely and the gear change was traditionally done only without the clutch.

 

“Stop using the quickshifter”. Deactivate it from the menu and never use it again. I know it sounds harsh but if you have a bike with a malfunctioning quickshifter nothing will help. Trust me!

 

Ok. Thanks. I will go to Triumph gays and try to return it. See what they told....

 

You really don't need to bring someone's sexual preferences in to the argument , that won't help at all

 

So they reprograming QS and says that should work. Will see.

 

Yeah, like I haven’t heard that before.

 

Try to make this post very short:
- my bike is at the dealer since 02/2020
- this after an official notice of default, or how do you say this in English? Summon? Via my insurance company
- already got other linkage clamp
- after 2 mails no reaction of triumph to me nor dealer
- my bike was inspected by an insurance expert together with the dealer
- after disassembly, the dealer and expert looked at the gearbox
- several damaged cogs and particles in the oil
- new gearbox under warranty
- covid hit us hard
- no more info today, I hope next week they can start again

 

Sorry to hear this Kazzz but yet more confirmation in my mind that I made the right choice in buying a bike without the QS.
Also lends more weight to the view that the problem is not solely due to the clashing of the shift arm and quickshifter body.
If you get a new gearbox, I would ask the dealer to either remove the shifter or deactivate it unless of course, they get to the bottom of what caused this.
Good luck with getting it sorted.