Coolant and hose replacement

Samco hoses and Evans Waterless coolant

On Saturday, I flushed out my coolant system and used the opportunity to replace the hoses with some red Samco hoses.

- Opened the radiator cap, removed lowest hose near the pump and let it flow to the bowl.
- Used a siphon to remove any remaining liquid in the expansion tank
- Removed the drain plug from the left side of the engine (between cylinder 1&2) and another 1/4 pint drained out.
- Undo the clips and ease the hoses off their mounts
- Clean the connections
- Slide new hoses into place and tighten with clips. First issue, the Samco clips I bought didn't correspond to the hose diameter. I used a couple of clips from the old hoses.
- When all hoses are in place, I top up with the Evans flush, for some reason, it only too 2lt of the stuff, the book says 2.4lt capacity! This is after burping the pipes, swaying the bike left to right and running it for a while to get as much air out as possible!
- Run the bike until the fan kicks in and then let it cool, later in the day took it out for a 20 min blast to make sure the flush mixes with as much remaining liquid as possible to extract as much water as possible.
- Drain the flush and then fill with the Evans Waterless coolant, again just a fraction more than 2lt went in, not near the 2.4lt!
- Took the bike for a couple of runs between heat cycles to get the coolant mixed in proper.
- A couple of hoses leaked at the connections so tightened these up, tighter than I was comfortable with but it was the only way to stop the leakage.

When the bike was at temperature I noticed the hoses were more solid than previously, not totally solid as there was some give, but there was no air in there and the radiator had an even spread of heat, plus between heat cycles I was checking there was no air in the system.

When I rode it into work this morning, I notice the bike is running hotter than normal! Whereas before the fan would kick in if sitting in traffic or at a light, now it is kicking in when I get into slow traffic, and not really turning off as quickly as before.

Both hoses and coolant are supposed to increase the efficiency of heat dispersion so I am not sure what is going on!
I am wondering if the original cause of my coolant blasting out the expansion tank has not been rectified, I am now considering replacing the thermostat valve but this would be another £50ish for the thermostat and o-ring.
Any thoughts, should I go back to normal coolant?

 

Well, now I feel stupid.
Straight away I notice the engine is running hotter than with normal 50/50 coolant, having just done a bit more digging, I have found out the following and explains all the symptoms I am getting:

From http://www.norosion.com/evanstest.htm
This is a competitor page to Evans, but it does raise some concerns!

97%+ removal of all previous coolant is mandatory in order to prevent corrosion.

Inhibitor deposition occurs on aluminum surfaces, which could cause issues in some radiators.

Engines run 115-140oF hotter (at the cylinder heads) with Evans products.

Stabilized coolant temps are increased by 31-48oF, versus straight water with No-Rosion.

Reprogramming ECU fan temp settings is mandatory to prevent the fan from running continuously.

Specific heat capacity of Evans waterless products ranges from 0.64 to 0.68, or about half that of water.

Engine octane requirement is increased by 5-7 numbers.

Computerized ignition must retard engine timing by 8-10o to prevent trace knock.

Engine horsepower is reduced by 4-5%.

Accelerated recession of non-hardened valve seats in older engines is possible, due to brinelling.

Viscosity is 3-4 times higher than what OEM water pumps are rated to accommodate.

Coolant flow rate through radiator tubes is reduced by 20-25% due to the higher viscosity.
Race tracks prohibit Evans products because they are flammable and slippery when spilled.

Time to ask some more questions with Evans and I feel I may have wasted some decent £££ on flush and coolant, and now may look to flush it again and go back to the 50/50!

 

Rose tinted glasses mate.
I think I wanted something new and advanced that was supposed to increase cooling efficiency, I read that as running cooler, this peaked my interest especially as the Speedies run hot! but it apparently only does this by increasing the average temp of the cooling system, exactly what I didn't want! So that is why my fan is constantly running in slow traffic.

It was only cuz' of the problems I am getting I have dug further than before.

I am heading to Amazon and get me some Castrol Motorcycle coolant.

However, I am well chuffed with the Samco hoses, I got the red ones and they are the dogs jewels as they are a perfect match with the Tornado Red paint.

I also fitted a K&N filter, not noticed any difference though :/

 

Well, I have to make a decision.
Do stay with Evans, or flush through again and go back to 50/50?
I can use TuneECU to increase the temp that the fan kicks in. But it is at the back of my mind that the thicker viscosity isn't doing the water pump or pipe connections any good, and the higher temp at the piston head may not be wise.

Is the Evans Waterless a better option than the Triumph recommended 50/50

 

I was hoping the Evans Waterless coolant would run with greater efficiency and with no detrimental effects on any part of the cooling system. However, the thicker viscosity effects the water pump, the engine runs hotter and the hoses feel a lot firmer then I recall previously, so there may be greater pressure in the system. All negative symptoms in my book.

I will just have to call this a lesson learned and go back to the 50/50, I would have better peace of mind which is what I am after.

 

I just got off the phone with Triumph technical (should've done this first!), and they do not recommend using anything other than premix coolant. The Evans Waterless Coolant is not compatible with the specification of the pump and radiator - or the coolant system in general.

Time to flush out and start again this weekend....bollox

 

I am planning on giving her a good and proper clean this weekend, after I have changed the coolant over.
I will then try and do a proper photo session to get the best photo I can and get the new photos uploaded

If i have time I aim to remove the SAI too, the previous owner had Arrows put on and removed the CAT at the same time, so now the system is popping like cannon on the over run. I will prbably plug the read plates with a bolt, there is a vid on YouTube on how to do this this. Delboys Garage - Tiger SAI blanking
I have confirmed with Triumph Technical this is okay to do, just need to update the ECU using TuneECU so it doesnt register as an engine fault.

With the new K&N air filter and SAI removal, I am wondering if it is worth booking her in for a custom tune job?

 

Thanks for the tip Big Lad, not a bad idea, I have an assortment of marbles and zip ties I can use. Shouldn't take long either, so I am tempted to do this when I get home this evening...

I know exactly where that pipe is, and incidentally it is next to a hole in the air box that is on the 'clean' side allowing dirty air in! I have already plugged this with a bolt.

 

Some low quality images of the pipes

 

This is a separate hole straight through the air box to the outside, nothing attached to it. It is a design flaw in the speed triple and Tigers that allows dirty air into the clean side of the air box, it just happens to be next to the AI pipe. The actual diameter is about the same size though.

 

The SAI pipe is already connected to the clean air side of the air box, this other hole is literally a hole through the box wall next to the SAI connection on the clean air side of the filter, but in the bottom of the air box about 6mm dia.
My observations was to point out that this is letting dirty air into the clean air side and potentially allowing debris into the breather intakes, and so needs plugging.

 

Three flushes and replaced Evans Waterless Coolant with Castrol Motorcycle Coolant, now running a lot cooler and I am a lot happier.
Also removed the SAI and blocked off the air box SAI outlet port and the three ports on the exhaust outlets.
Followed this guide by Mark Robbins on YouTube "Linky"
Updated the ECU using TuneECU, unticked the SAI box on the diagnostics section so the Engine Management light doesn't come on.
The bike now sounds so much smoother with no excessive popping and backfiring.

Just need to clean the bike now and get some decent photos.