Help - my riding is *rap!

Discussion in 'Newbies Hangout' started by TT600Des, Nov 14, 2014.

  1. crispey

    crispey crispey creme de la creme

    Nov 6, 2014
    7,229
    1,000
    Uk
    I know where you are coming from, Des. I am a returned rider after years of inactivity, my last bikes where a BMW and '58 thunderbird, bought a thruxton, totally different riding pos, went out and went straight at my first tight left turn :-? Too fast, no proper preparation and lack of confidence. I took it a bit easier and got home to my roadcraft book, took an IAM test 20 years ago, read through it went through some corners in my head and next time I went out I felt and rode a lot better! Taught me not to ride in the past but in the present. I also followed a trusted friend through some country lanes which helped with lines and speed. If you're not getting the confidence back by yourself do as Collamb recommends. As you're an MK man you couldn't do worse than looking here. Good Luck
     
  2. TT600Des

    TT600Des Member

    Nov 5, 2014
    9
    8
    Buckinghamshire
    Quite right in that the bike is a different riding position although quite comfortable I find. I did have a chum of mine (a very experienced biker of 40 years) take the bike out for me to give the 'once-over', and he pronounced it exactly as he'd expect. Dissapointing - as this proved it was 'me' and not the bike at fault. It's done 12,000 miles, so once again - correct in that it might not be in the first flush of youth.

    'A twist of the wrist' as said previously really pressed the button for me: 'Counter steering' riding loose and holding the bike with my knees was the answer. Spending several days thinking about it before getting back on, and reading everything I could on counter steering in the meanwhile so that I had it in my head before venturing out again, has just resulted in a short ride just now that was every bit as pleasing as the previous ones have been depressing.

    I need loads more practice, and 'yes' some very serious re-training, but previously - without the combined help and reassurance of you all, I'd not have made it to the training centre without falling off! That may read as humourious statement - but it's actually quite true as I was 'over' and 'under' steering everywhere and all over the place. Thank you for your help and reassurance everyone, I really can't thank you all enough.

    Best wishes. Des.
     
  3. TT600Des

    TT600Des Member

    Nov 5, 2014
    9
    8
    Buckinghamshire
    Thanks: I'll get in contact, but the website looks as if it's forgotten..... "Latest News" is Jan 2013, and no events showing at all.

    Many thanks though!
     
  4. TT600Des

    TT600Des Member

    Nov 5, 2014
    9
    8
    Buckinghamshire
    I have to admit I remember using those 3d coins! Serious practice & training in hand.
     
  5. folkbloke

    folkbloke Well-Known Member

    Jul 20, 2013
    310
    63
    Sussex
    #25 folkbloke, Nov 19, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2014
    It's weird but I can't remember anyone mentioning counter-steering until about 20 years ago and even then it was more in relation to track days than road riding.

    Somehow I'd been riding for 20 years without knowing about it :wink:

    I'm still not sure that it doesn't confuse new riders as counter-steering is so counter-intuitive. If I think about it my riding gets completely messed up (then again I'm a bit of a dinosaur I suppose who nearly ran off the road after a year out as he couldn't remember how to go round a roundabout)

    It's not something I'd ever consciously done until recently when I took a 1600TB out for a test ride and the thing would not go round corners (due I think to seized head bearings and it should never have been let out for test rides :mad:) I was consciously having to apply opposite lock to the bars to get it round corners. A good example of how it works but it's the first time I've really been aware of needing to use it.
     
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  6. sprintdave

    sprintdave Nurse, think it's time for his medications.
    Subscriber

    May 25, 2014
    1,548
    750
    Birmingham
    I agree totally with you folkbloke about countersteering. I certainly never used it at least not knowingly on my old BSAs,Bonnie or CB750. I guess its coz I am an old boy but it doesnt come naturally to me so I just have a little play sometimes. I can understand and see why Rossi,Marquez, Lorenzo etc do it,hey maybe thats why Cal keeps coming off, coz he cant do it either,lol.
     
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  7. PJT

    PJT Active Member

    Oct 20, 2014
    116
    43
    Leicestershire. UK.
    I've never heard of counter steering either. It was never mentioned when I first learnt to ride nor when I did my motorcycle course in the Army all those years ago.
     
  8. TT600Des

    TT600Des Member

    Nov 5, 2014
    9
    8
    Buckinghamshire
    To be honest - me neither previously. Could it be though the design of the 'Sports Bike'? I don't remember anything about counter steering with my Meriden Bonnie either, but you have too with the TT or you'll be off, or at best over or under steering.
     
  9. ColLamb

    ColLamb Active Member

    Jun 29, 2014
    134
    43
    Preston, Lancashire
    Wow, what a response since my use of the countersteering term.

    If you want to blow your mind wiki the term then try to understand the description

    Countersteering - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Its a very impressive explanation.

    In practice we use it as second nature, we have too, we would fall off if we did not use it. Only at very low speeds do you turn the bars clockwise to turn right, next time you do a U turn take particular notice of what you do
     
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  10. folkbloke

    folkbloke Well-Known Member

    Jul 20, 2013
    310
    63
    Sussex
  11. PJT

    PJT Active Member

    Oct 20, 2014
    116
    43
    Leicestershire. UK.
    Thanks for that Col. We live and learn.
     
  12. ColLamb

    ColLamb Active Member

    Jun 29, 2014
    134
    43
    Preston, Lancashire
    I was specifically tought countersteering on a very long, straight and empty country road.

    Riding at 30 in the middle of the road applying just gently and slow forward pressiure the left bar, then the right, then the left etc with the result being a series of linked gradual S turns.

    As I becambe more confident the steering input was increased and more rapid turns ensued.
     
  13. Dodge74

    Dodge74 Active Member

    Oct 16, 2014
    151
    43
    Lincoln
    I can also highly recommend the Californian Superbike school , very good , there are four parts but part 1 I found was the best & very enjoyable (some would say expensive but I'd rather spend money on rider training than an Ohlins rear shock tbh - also bikesafe is very good , and hop rider training is well worth doing (they do a great session on low speed handling - u-turns etc which most people found the hardest to deal with)
    As an aside - what are the tyres like on your bike - there is nothing worse than poor quality or unevenly worn (or incorrect pressures) tyres to affect the handling of a bike & make you think its your riding skills to blame
     
  14. sprintdave

    sprintdave Nurse, think it's time for his medications.
    Subscriber

    May 25, 2014
    1,548
    750
    Birmingham
    #34 sprintdave, Nov 22, 2014
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2014
    Have to agree with the last statement. My Sprint will not turn if the front tyre pressure drops much. When I bought it a couple of years ago I rode back to Birmingham from Milton Keynes and it felt weird, I thought it was the way the bike was as I had read about heavy handling. I next used the bike a week later and needed fuel so rode to the nearest garage. I came to an island and it wanted to go straight on,I had to wrestle it round,it was not nice at all. I put a couple of quids worth of fuel in,didnt fancy the idea of a full tank tbh. Went over to the air lines to check the tyres and my front had just 22 lbs in, should be 36, the rear was a few lbs down too. Pumped that to 41 and gingerly rode to the island again, this time the bike flew round and felt like a new bike. After having had the bie a few months I changed tyres and had a small issue with a slight loss of pressure over a few weeks so now check before riding off.( Yes i know you should anyway but who does really,lol) Just a small drop seems to upset the handling for me. Recently had my wheels renovated and powder coated and it seems to have sorted the problem out now thank God.

    Back to the thread, I can see what has been said about doing the countersteering without even knowing. I realise now that I have done that for years in slow manoeuvres. I am now playing with it while taking bends and can see the benefits, tho I aint Marquez yet
     
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  15. ColLamb

    ColLamb Active Member

    Jun 29, 2014
    134
    43
    Preston, Lancashire
    The more you know and practice then better and safer biker you become.

    So the next time you have an oh *rap moment when you are enrering a bend to fast, more countersteer input and more power and round you go, probably dragging the pegs or in my case leaving shoe leather on the road as my boots touch down before the pegs
     
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  16. PJT

    PJT Active Member

    Oct 20, 2014
    116
    43
    Leicestershire. UK.
    Well I hope we all live and learn. It's always useful to hear other riders experiences. :upyeah:
     
  17. crispey

    crispey crispey creme de la creme

    Nov 6, 2014
    7,229
    1,000
    Uk
    I learnt counter-steering back in the early 80's round Hammersmith roundabout on my 400/4, wide one way round to the right, hanging off the saddle with the knee out you naturally start pulling in on the left hand, I don't think you can get above 5mph round there now so no chance of repeating it!!! The best example of countersteering is speedway I guess!
     
  18. chrispy

    chrispy Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2013
    331
    83
    Salisbury,wiltshire
    Welcome to the forum :upyeah:
     

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