Problem Shifting - Advice Please

Discussion in 'Speed Triple' started by R_1000, Feb 25, 2017.

  1. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    2011 speed triple. Has a translogic quickshifter.

    Today out of the blue I couldn't shift the gear from 1st to 2nd or any gears going up. I had to kick the crap out of it to shift. However from 1st to all the way up the quickshifter is super smooth. I just can't seem to shift it manually :(

    Checked the clutch adjustment and it seems ok. I just replaced the chain and the slack seems ok. But this issue has only propped up after changing the chain and sprockets.

    It just started happening on my way back through town. I'm lost :confused:

    The shifting was so hard, I'm sitting here massaging my toes:(

    Any advice is greatly appreciated.
     
  2. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    I tried moving the shift between 1st n 2nd gentle with my hand n I can hear a clicking noise. Meaning I'm not going into 1st nor 2nd. The clicking noise is in between. Is that normal
     
  3. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    I know it's going to be a pain, but I would start by refitting the engine sprocket that you took off and see if it returns to 'normal'
    If it does you know that something is wrong with the new sprocket.
    Were there any shims in place ?
    Compare the old and new sprockets when off the bike and check for any noticeable differences other than the number of teeth.
    I am hoping when you have changed it you have not bent or twisted the sprocket drive-shaft, because as you know they are tight.
     
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  4. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    Oh boy. I didn't change them, I gave it to a local shop n stood there watching them work on it. They used an impact gun to remove it and used a torque wrench to fit it back on. The sprockets are Triumph OEM. As you said I'll try and remove the front sprocket and see what's happening
     
  5. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    I'm not meaning to panic you R_1000, it's just when you have an immediate change in the feel of mechanical things, you should normally be able to trace it back to the last mechanical work carried out, in this case sprockets and chain. I wouldn't imagine for a minute the chain or rear sprocket is at fault.
    My gut instinct is the engine sprocket unless a coincidental problem has shown up? Which is unlikely!
    Keep us posted, and I hope it turns out to be something simple.
     
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  6. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    ^^^ I appreciate your time on this buddy. I'm 100% in agreement with you. The odd things is I rode the bike for about 2 hours and did not experience a single issue. I parked the bike had a coffee then fired her up and the shifting problems started.

    I'll dig into it n update you all
     
  7. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    Ah now then a bit more information is coming to light.
    The fact that you had ridden the bike for 2 hours before the problem appearred could be more like something working loose.
    Check the front sprocket is tight and the tab washer is correctly bent up to stop vibration loosening.
    Check that no silly little bolts have come loose or debris that may have got wedged round the sprocket area.
     
  8. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    ^^^^ sure thing buddy. I'll give it a good look and get back to you.
     
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  9. Waynedarcie

    Waynedarcie Active Member

    Aug 31, 2016
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    Not my thing (mechanics).
    But do you think while you had a coffee some little twit has messed with your clutch cable adjustment. Doesn't take much of a twiddle to muck up your gears.
     
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  10. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    They were a few people walking around my bike n pointing and talking about it. But they looked mature adults. Good point. I'll look at that 1st
     
  11. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    Since I just installed new chain and sprocket, I am not sure they have adjusted the chain properly. I think they have left it on the tight side!!!

    Mine is a 2011 speed triple. I am going to check for tight spots and adjust it from there. Would it be safe to say once I find the tight spot spinning the wheel on rear paddock stand then leave her on the side stand and adjust the chain to a slack of 35-40mm.

    Thank you all
     
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  12. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    #12 MickEng, Feb 27, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2017
    R_1000, have your bike on the side stand when you check the chain tension, I would say 32mm (1.25") slack
    There should not really be any tight spots as it is a new chain, but still worth checking in a few different positions.
    Side stand keeps the normal bike weight on the swing arm.
    Having it on the paddock stand or a centre stand seems to be logically correct but it isn't.

    CORRECTION. Paddock stand is okay to use for chain adjustment. My apologies.
     
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  13. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    ^^^
    Thank you I will give that a go with many other things:
    1 Check to make sure no loose bolts around the shifting area
    2 Remove front sprocket cover and see if all good
    3 Check the chain adjustment
    4 Readjust the clutch cable - 2-3mm free play at the lever / Clutch cover side a wee bit of free play, I am not sure what it's called - Actuator??

    Clutch Adjustment recap -
    Lever - Dial in all the way in towards the clutch perch
    Clutch cover side loosen the lock nuts and adjust until you feel a wee bit of a play on the cable then lock into place.
    Back at the clutch lever - Dial the adjuster out until there is a 2-3 mm free play between the clutch lever and the clutch perch.

    Would you be able to kindly confirm if I am going about the right way.

    Kind regards
    H
     
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  14. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    All makes sense.
    Anything you change just keep a record on the number of turns or part turns just in case you want to go back to how it is now.
     
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  15. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    #15 R_1000, Feb 27, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2017
    Ok here we go. ...

    Chain slack was around 50mm. Reduced it now n it's somewhere around 35mm.

    Adjusted the clutch cable.

    Checked the sprocket n nothing out ordinary

    Shifting linkage bolts are all good.

    Fired the bike up. Held my breath and put it in 1st. I didn't even realise it's gone into 1st. Super smooth.

    Drove around in the car park n went for 2nd...again super smooth.

    So I think the clutch went out of adjustment n now sorted. I'd know more once I take her out for a good blast. Touch wood. ...I hope she behaves herself ;)

    Thank you all lovely people for guiding me. I very much appreciate your help. I'll give more updates if I get the chance to take the bike for a blast.

    rsz_20170227_215527.jpg rsz_20170227_215544.jpg
     
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  16. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    #16 MickEng, Feb 28, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2017
    Good work R_1000

    I am surprised that the technician who fitted the sprocket did not make a neater job of bending the washer down to align with the flat on the nut, but that's probably me being anal, I do like things perfecto!

    More importantly in the bottom photo there is a 90 degree bracket holding an adjusting rod.
    This bracket has a Nyloc nut that does not have any male thread coming into the nylon portion.
    The bracket probably has a threaded hole (like the one at the side which has not been used) so I would imagine the bracket is held by a bolt or stud from the underside into that threaded hole and the Nyloc nut is there as a secondary safety locking nut.
    The problem is there is no male thread visible and certainly not into the nylon locking portion so that nut could vibrate loose and find its way into your moving chain and sprocket, or it could drop off altogether being that it is below the sprocket and chain.
    I would get that checked out with your Triumph dealer, it is not right and if the bike left the factory like that it shouldn't have.
    It may very well be an after market mod ?
    Basically it needs a longer bolt or stud that locks into the Nyloc nut!

    A bit of protective oil on the sprocket nut wouldn't go amiss either! lol
     
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  17. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    Thank you MickEng :)

    You are spot on MickENg :D noticing that bracket and the rusty nut.

    The bracket is the one connected to the translogic QS. It was me did the fitting :( and obviously I didn't do a good job of it. I was a little concerned about the male thread not coming through then after a while it just slipped my mind until yesterday when I was looking at it. You are again right on the bracket.....it does have threads in them. I will source a longer bolt and maybe even dab a little Locktite. As for the sprocket nut, now that you have mentioned it, its going to be bugging me. So I shall remove the cover and dab a little oil and keep it clean and maybe tap that washer to sit flush against the nut :D

    Seriously MickEng....Thanks a million for taking the time to guide me through this buddy.

    I just hope this shifting issue doesn't prop up again once the engine is properly warmed up and going for a good run. Just keeping my fingers crossed;)
     
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  18. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    My pleasure!

    The tab washer would bug me, I would tap it flat.

    If you fit a longer bolt that engages with the Nylon in theory you do not have to use any threadlock adhesive.
    But if you feel better adding a dab for peace of mind then it wont harm.

    Have you thought about fitting a Scottoiler or similar for your chain?
     
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  19. R_1000

    R_1000 Elite Member
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    The bike only goes out for a weekend ride (providing it's not wet) and I always clean and lube the chain. Also I thought the Scottoiler would make my wheel messy :confused:

    I use a lube called Belray Blu Tac. Super sticky and does not fling.

    http://www.belray.com/bel-ray-blue-tac-chain-lube

    If the Scotoiler won't make the wheels messy then I will defo be interested as it would constantly keep my chain lubed. One less thing for me to worry about;)
     
  20. MickEng

    MickEng Noble Member

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    The Scottoiler has infinite settings so can be set perfectly to your bike.
    The standard setting is one drop of oil per 60secs.
    No oil fling on tyres or anywhere else if set correctly, keeps your sprockets and chain clean and lubricated.
    If you are satisfied with your current method and cover only relatively low mileage you may prefer to leave well alone.
    I use my bike virtually every day, find the Scottoiler virtually maintenance free and know that my chain is always nicely lubricated.
     
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